Damascus

May. 12th, 2010 02:04 pm
liadnan: (Default)
[personal profile] liadnan

I realise now that when I voted LibDem, in my Labour/Respect marginal constituency, what I was really voting for was the "progressive coalition" and that I should now feel angered enough to be turning to the Labour party.

To discover the views of the "progressive coalition" I look to the voting record of Ben Bradshaw, one of those who has explained it all to me by banging on about this again and again: it turns out that it includes strong progressive policies like being strongly for ID Cards; against laws to stop climate change; for the anti-terrorism laws of the last decade, ministerial intervention in inquests and a stricter asylum system; and opposing an inquiry into the Iraq war.

Yes, that's it. And what I really wanted was for the Ministry of Justice to remain in the hands of Jack Straw, someone I believe to have colluded in torture, and for others who I believe lied to take us into a disastrous war to remain in government as well.

It certainly couldn't possibly have been true that not only did I object to all of that, I put a very high priority on those specific issues.

Date: 2010-05-12 01:38 pm (UTC)
chickenfeet: (Default)
From: [personal profile] chickenfeet
The trouble is that with the exception of the ID cards the new lot are at least as bad on all the issues you cite. The sad fact is that there isn't a progressive option on offer in the UK. You can pick any of three more or less right of centre parties; all of which pander to racists, are instinctively authoritarian and prone to fight stupid foreign wars any time the Americans ask.

Date: 2010-05-12 03:06 pm (UTC)
ankaret: (Atomic Grapes)
From: [personal profile] ankaret
Your friends are amateurs. I've seen people bring the Disraeli government into this before now.

Date: 2010-05-12 03:26 pm (UTC)
ankaret: (Keyboard Galaxy)
From: [personal profile] ankaret
... at least he didn't accuse him of Dutch courage?

Date: 2010-05-12 03:21 pm (UTC)
ankaret: Picture of woman with a cat (Escaping Jellica)
From: [personal profile] ankaret
Yes, actually. I keep waiting for the present discussion of electoral reform to come up with a catchphrase that rolls off the tongue the way 'rotten boroughs' does.

I am shamefully ignorant about the history of the Liberals during the 1920s. What happened?

Date: 2010-05-12 11:10 pm (UTC)
matgb: Artwork of 19th century upper class anarchist, text: MatGB (Default)
From: [personal profile] matgb
I use Rotten Boroughs in the context of current electoral system. Burnley only just voted out a Labour MP for the first time in decades, there're parts of London with no non-Labour Cllrs, parts of rural England that're always run by Conservatives. And a few places that've been Lib Dem for a bit longer than I'm comfortable with.

Same party in power for too long, without a lot of renewal, can lead to complacency and corruption, hence rotten boroughs works.

I definitely think that parts of the NE fit the classic meaning of Rotten Borough though, as do parts of the SW.

Date: 2010-05-12 02:17 pm (UTC)
fanf: (Default)
From: [personal profile] fanf
WRT civil liberties, check out the plans for the Great Repeal Bill / Freedom Bill.

Date: 2010-05-12 02:37 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] frankie_ecap
One of the most fascinating divides I'm seeing is that between those who have 'party' affiliations and those who have 'policy' affiliations. For obvious reasons, the second lot are having more fun than the first lot right now.

Date: 2010-05-12 11:12 pm (UTC)
matgb: Artwork of 19th century upper class anarchist, text: MatGB (Default)
From: [personal profile] matgb
Yup. It's always been about the policy for me.

Then, I proposed a Lib Dem/Tory coalition in 2006, before I joined the LDs. Ahead of the curve, me. Got slated by a lot of LDs at the time, IIRC. Including some of those now most in favour.

To be fair, the guy who best told me I was wrong then has resigned the party over it now.

Date: 2010-05-12 04:31 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] hano
I'll be delighted if they get rid of ID cards etc. Although the appointment of Teresa May as Home Secretary doesn't bode well from a civil liberties point of view. Worse is Peter Ricketts as head of the the National Security Council. (I'll post about this new NSC when I've got past my exams and when I've got my head round it, I'm not entirely sure it's a good idea.) Still, they're making the right noises so far and I can only hope they folow them up with actions. So I guess I'll give them the benefit of the doubt. I did sort of vote for them after all.
(I did get a little emotional last night, seeing David Cameron walk into Downing Street had that effect on a lot of people I suspect)
I look forward to the Labour Party welcoming you with both arms. Or something :)

Date: 2010-05-12 04:54 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] hano
Almost certainly no coincidence. This morning it was saying somethng like 'in light of the change of government we're freezing the issue of new ID cards. All current cards remain valid yadda yadda yadda.' This is absolutely a Good Thing. Anyone know what's happening with the DEBill?

Date: 2010-05-12 06:32 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] hano
The Tories didn't make much noise about it at all. But neither did a single LibDem go for it, quite the opposite in fact. Full listing is here. In fact the vadt majority of MPs who voted in favour were Labour. Curiously, not one of the Labour MPs who voted in favour actually attended the debate. Ask [personal profile] gmh for the grisly details, he's still spitting blood about the whole thing.
Serious props to Evan Harris, Lynne Featherstone and Tom Watson for doing their damndest to stop what is probably an unworkable piece of legislation.

Date: 2010-05-12 11:14 pm (UTC)
matgb: Artwork of 19th century upper class anarchist, text: MatGB (Default)
From: [personal profile] matgb
IIRC, DEBill was put into the Freedom Bill proposals, which is in the agreement.

But I might be misremembering.

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liadnan

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